The growing debate around SACAP fees and the role of the organisation

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Colin Hope on April 17, 2009 at 10:19am

Hi there, perhaps one should firstly make known to members, SACAP's role and responsibilities and imput, etc, to our industry, prior to commenting positively or negetatively about the organisation!
I had communication with them awhile ago on their long winded membership requirements, man what a mess!
I will only participate further once their role has been clarified.
This should be an interesting debate and i am looking forward to it.
Regards,
Colin Hope.

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Permalink Reply by Derek Harris on April 17, 2009 at 12:32pm

Couldn't agree more with you, Colin.Something else which I find almost impossible is to get onto is events which garner CPD points as information about them seems to come through (in my experience anyway) at the last minute and are fully booked (has anyone worked out the cost in compiling 25 points including the time lost?)
Derek Harris

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Permalink Reply by Phillip on April 18, 2009 at 12:31am

Ye! I could agree with Dere/Col mind me, and the most part is the member fee that is required even if you may not know that you're are a fully certified architect within them. I was registered and fully paid their fees and was sent a message that the certificate of registering will be sent thats years ago till todate and that other certificates are issued and affidavits should be sent to them so they can send them to rightfull owners. Well what about using other person registering number ? and something else they don't have a say to the submissions and processes on council on approvals nor suggestion to relevant admin. What about their introduction to the council itself about their concern to have their law being placed to the council to impliment prio-architect members needs and compliances.The most part of all the pool or may I say commemorations.Least but last their mags when last I had them. Its quit a journey. For me there is no were to turn to for information that is so important to me maybe you!
P. Desi.

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Permalink Reply by Derek Harris on April 20, 2009 at 6:15am

eh?

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Permalink Reply by Auriel Susa'n Jordaan on April 19, 2009 at 7:30am

Join SAIAT OR SAIA, You get one credit for voluntary membership, pay their annual fee, and recieve the information on cpd events in time! Membership entitles you to a small rebate on SACAPs annual fee.
Auriel

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Permalink Reply by Derek Harris on April 20, 2009 at 6:14am

I'll give that a try, Derek

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Permalink Reply by David Clark on April 21, 2009 at 1:13pm

I haven't read all of the comments, but the principle impression I get is the real lack of understanding of the origin and prime function of SACAP - this is not a voluntary organization - it is a construct arising from an Act of Parliament to administer the function of registering persons who may then be entitled under the law to practice at various levels in the built environment professions. For this, registration and compliance at whatever level is not optional, or at the whim of some person or group of persons. Because it is a Statutory Act, the only way to change it is through an amendment at parliamentary level. It would appear that recent attempts to change this structure, from the top down, were thwarted by informed and collaborative action from the various BE professions. This was well reported so I won't elaborate here.

This construct (SACAP) is a protection mechanism for both the registered person and their clients. It's only an obstacle if you make it so.

There is a similar windblast of whinging going on in the UK (see http://www.bdonline.co.uk/story.asp?storycode=3138575&origin=BD... and elsewhere on that site ) over RIBA and the equivalent registration body. Most of the whinging is identical in character to what I read here, and appears to be just as uninformed. In India, they have their troubles, too (see http://www.worldarchitecturenews.com/index.php?fuseaction=wanappln.... ).

To think one can change the registration requirement is equivalent to going out on the pier at Kalk Bay and relieving yourself into the face of the South Easter, the only thing that will get wet is one's own face. Most of the whinging is from technologists, and before you start flaming me, take note that while I am registered in the PrArch category, I spent nearly 30 years in the profession as a designer doing the equivalent work of an architect, before registration 12 years ago, due to a health issue that prevented me from completing my degree back then. I've seen both sides of this 'fence' that seems to be causing some so much (self-inflicted) agony.

The lack of professionalism and respect between practitioners and the lack of cohesion as a multi-tiered profession against the erosion of standing in the industry is of much greater concern. It affects our wallets far beyond a simple huff-and-puff over the registration and CPD requirements and fee.

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Permalink Reply by phillip newmarch on April 24, 2009 at 12:29am

David
Just as you haven't read all the comments, it seems to me you haven't actually read the ACT either. As you say, it establishes SACAP, but says very little about what it is to do. The ACT's only real sin is to allow a collection of bureaucrats the opportunity to stamp their ultra-conservatism on the profession. What SACAP is doing is not "law" at all. It is simply ego-megalomaniac hotheads on legal crutches trying to control what everybody does. Unfortunately, too many architects are not able to work without those crutches, and trying to whack everybody with them is probably one of the worst disasters in the history of public relations.

But I must genuinely thank you for the links you provide. They are really very interesting. Note also the one referred to in the first: http://www.sesquipedalist.com/2009/04/protectionism.html

It is worth noting that India, more than 20 times the size of SA, has only twice as many registered architectural professionals (25 000), 9 800 of whom have "defected" from their registering body. I wonder why?

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Permalink Reply by Basil Barreto on April 24, 2009 at 7:51am

I fully agree regarding the CPD points, I've contacted SACAP several times because of not being informed regarding where and when one can gain CPD points, never received any e-mails while other fellow colloquies who are affiliated to SAIAT are being kept up to date and notified on a regular basis. Taking this into consideration and the pathetic service, I just can't see how the annual fees can be so high. They should really review their standards to be worth what they represent.

Basil Barreto

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Permalink Reply by john murphy on April 25, 2009 at 3:24pm

By becoming a member of the SOUTH AFRICAN INSTITUTE OF BUILDING DESIGN you are afforded 1 CPD point and will be kept up to date regarding CPD seminars when and where they will occur.
website http://www.saibd.co.za
We will also keep one informed regards SACAP as our board members keep in contact with them on a regular basis.
As a regulating body SACAP ishere to stay , therefore more professionals out there who are nt members of V A s should think seriously of joining , in this way your voices can be heard. Volintary associations need member numbers to be effective.
SACAP need your positive input also to aid them in their learning curve.
Its our livelyhood that will ultimately be affected and one lonely voice in the wilderness will be drowned by the wind.

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Permalink Reply by Rashaad Adam Jogie on April 27, 2009 at 3:57pm

Good day All, I totally agree with all members who are greatly disturbed by the latest price hike in the SACAP fees. I feel almost as been held to randsome to pay this ridiculous amount because as we all know, we cannot practice without a SACAP registration. In the current economic climate, I find SACAP to be totally unaccomodating and ignorant to the situation that many people find themselves in. It is very difficult to justify exactly what SACAP purpose of existence is as only receive one piece of correspondence from them every year and thats my Invoice!

Regards

Rashaad Jogie

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Permalink Reply by Peter Adlard on April 28, 2009 at 3:41pm

I'm in private practice in a town that should be categorized as 'rural'. I am a emmber of the local Institute, 1.5hrs drive away. There are insufficient CPD points available in my region, and I am PISSED at having to travel a long way and then pay to hear something I don't want to hear in oredr to get 1/3 of a CPD point. This DOES NOT happen oversees, where CPD function are preesented to architects in their own offices for FREE with FREE LUNCHES to boot. I have an ongoing dispute with SACAP re their mandatory role to enforce the Architect's Act (bear in mind that David Clarke above is wrong in saying that SACAP is a protection mechansim for professionals and their clients - it's a construct of the architect's act which exists primarily to protect the public from the architects and their clients).I regret that SACAP see themselves as the mandatory recipients of inflated fees but not as the enforcers of the ACT. SACAP's militarism re this website is fruit of this misunderstanding - attacking freedom of speach rather than malpractice.I have now started to copy my correspondence to SACAP to the CBE, and the CBE are starting to crack the whip. SACAP received unprecedented support last year for their defence against being swallowed up by the CBE, and perhaos we're caught here between the devil and the deep blue sea. At least with SACAP there is representivity - almost none, but at least we can can call it 'our' regualtory body. If the CBE takes over we're going to be in trouble, no matter how good the CBE personnel might be.

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